Citizenship and Justice

Sunday, January 29, 2023
First Aired: 
Sunday, September 13, 2020

What Is It

Securing citizenship to a developed country could guarantee people enormous privileges and opportunities. Some condemn those who try illegally to reap the benefits that come with such citizenship. But are our ways of determining who gets to enter borders arbitrary and unfair? Should we grant border access to people born in a nation’s territories, or also on people whose parents were citizens? Or should we favor the highly skilled who can contribute the most to the nation? What is the most just way to determine citizenship? Josh and Ray cross the border with Arash Abizadeh from McGill University, author of Hobbes and the Two Faces of Ethics.

Transcript

Transcript

Josh Landy  
Why do some countries make it so hard to become a citizen?

Ray Briggs  
Should your political rights really depend on where you were born?

Josh Landy  
Would it be better to live in a world without borders?

Comments (6)


Harold G. Neuman's picture

Harold G. Neuman

Tuesday, May 4, 2021 -- 8:11 AM

Citizenship is a privilege,

Citizenship is a privilege, not a right. Where one is born is not within his/her control. A nation's resources are limited---even in the long view that emerges in the wealthiest and most powerful. That there are limits is not always readily admitted by liberal progressives, who believe all ought to have access to a better life. And fundamental human rights. My view on this issue is not always well-received. This nation's reputation as saviour to the world is more mythical than practical. I just have the nerve to say so.

Daniel's picture

Daniel

Tuesday, January 24, 2023 -- 10:24 AM

So I suppose that I "just

So I suppose that I "just have the nerve" to agree with you. The mythology to which you refer is characteristic of imperial systems in general, but the U.S. version contains a duplicitous cynicism of singular moral improbity. Because the current system of state capitalism, even if imperfect, is the best one that history has come up with, so goes the narrative, there's no need to improve upon it, and its "mistakes", i.e. former crimes committed by the state, can be forgiven as aberrations. The mythological reference is to the idea that there's such a thing as a benevolent empire, and therefore if ours is threatening a smaller state or supporting or contributing to the oppression of its people, it must be because it deserves it in some or another way, and the subsequent suffering of its population is translated by the educated classes into an acceptable bi-product of just, if unfortunate, action. On the issue of citizenship, I agree that it's a privilege. It can serve to protect one's rights without having to be one. Most significant is the responsibility it involves, rather than any privileges it bestows. Above all, knowledge of the country's history and responsibility for the well-being of fellow citizens ought to figure prominently as cross-fertilizing tasks to which citizens are obliged. Since the views expressed here are not inaccurately described as in the minority, sincere invitation is extended to the putting-forth of any departure from them. In short, how is this wrong?

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Harold G. Neuman's picture

Harold G. Neuman

Tuesday, May 18, 2021 -- 7:03 AM

We can no longer welcome

We can no longer welcome everyone's tired and poor, seems to me. That was several yesterdays ago. Now, due to many contingencies, we have more than enough of our own and barely the available resources to assist them towards becoming rested and gainfully employed. But, lip-service aside, such is not;was never a priority anyway. Philanthropy spins a good yarn and shores up reputations which have been tarnished by personal aspiration. In short, it makes people look better than they deserve.

Daniel's picture

Daniel

Thursday, January 19, 2023 -- 10:47 AM

That's very interesting, -

That's very interesting, --the nexus between appearance and desert, I mean (cf. the 5/18/21 post above). So if someone buys two ice cream cones and gives one to someone else who can't afford one, she/he looks pretty good; -until it's discovered that the money used to buy them was stolen from a donation box at a local charity. Then she/he looks pretty bad or, continuing your framing of the matter, they would appear no better than they deserve to appear. What's so interesting here is that you seemed to have solved a very old philosophical puzzle about the correspondence between the respective objects of theoretical and practical reasoning, insofar as one's appearance can be calibrated to one's actions by the notion of deservedness, with the result that no gap occurs between them, on the condition that all the details of how the appearance came into being can be specified. But how far does this seamless nexus extend? When the recipient of the ice cream cone in the above example finds out about how the purchase was funded, for instance, would it have any effect on its taste and the pleasure of consuming it? Could one assert that because it was purchased with ill-gotten gains, whoever eats it doesn't deserve to enjoy it? The fates of entire civilizations may well have turned on matters of less import. As its burgeoning profundity can be borne by only the most nimble of spirits, to withhold expression of gratitude for its occurrence could amount to nothing else but neglect, undeserving of favorable appearance.

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Daniel's picture

Daniel

Saturday, January 21, 2023 -- 11:19 AM

--This expression of

--This expression of gratitude is of course directed towards the author of the 5/18/21 post, for solving Kant's problem of the famous "gap" between the principles of practical and theoretical reasoning. This latter consists of, for summary purposes, an apparently irreconcilable difference between two kinds of causes for explanation: a descending series, moving from diverse effects to maximally few causes (theoretical), and an ascending series, going from singular causes to multiple effects (practical). The first refers to a causal continuity associated with a presumed lawfulness of nature, the second to a discrete causality which describes deliberate action. Deserved praise and justified reward only make sense in the latter case, as attributable to an action's causal deliberateness, independent of determination by its real effects. What the author points out, however, is that an agent's external appearance carries with it both interpretive categories for potential observers. In applying the notion of desert to the only apparently moral agent, by this, the observer constitutes a third element which not only combines the two categories of reasoning, but is exactly adjusted to any shift in knowledge of an effect's cause. Would the post's author concede to this analysis? If so, it receives my recommendation for inclusion into the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy.

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Daniel's picture

Daniel

Wednesday, January 25, 2023 -- 10:59 AM

--So instead of undeserved

--So instead of undeserved praise for its recipient which occurs by a misapprehension, as participant Neuman describes in the 5/18/21 post, what's the result in the case of deserved blame which is withheld by one who could give it? For one who receives undeserved praise is obliged to reject it, but whoever is deservedly blamed could only demand its retraction if blaming constitutes a kind of harm to the blameworthy which would in turn make the blamer more blameworthy than the blamed. And both what one is blamed for and the actual blaming must be understood as actions with effects in the causal chain of appearances whose inception is understood as having discrete causal grounds which appear spontaneous. Withholding blame for the blameworthy therefore denies a distinct representation of it while retaining the coterminous status of its two parts. An agent's blame-desert derives, then, from the absence of any demand not to be blamed, whereas no such demand applies to the obligation to blame, which must be adjusted in accordance to any blameworthy harm which might result from the blaming. As applied to withholding blame for the justifiably blamable on the basis of the blamer's blameworthiness were the blamable to be blamed, the statement "if a is b, then a is not not b" need not be understood as a strict tautology. By restricting the antecedent to the concepts of the respective subject and predicate together with the consequent's remaining open to experience-contents in blaming and the blamed, it remains possible to withhold blame compatibly with absence of any claim of blamelessness on the part of the blameworthy, while a demand not to be blamed could still be made if the blamer's blame for blaming overrides blame-legitimacy by the blamer's harm to the blamed. Does that sound about right?

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