Prostitution

Sunday, May 15, 2005 -- 5:00 PM
John Perry

The American Heritage Dictionary defines prostitution as “the act or practice of engaging in sex acts for hire.”  This definition may be a little obsolete.  First, while people of my generation include such things as oral sex under the term “sex acts,” the term now is often restricted to sexual intercourse.  Whether this is the effect of President Clinton’s use, or he was in fact simply very up-to-date, I do not know.  But if you look at online solicitations of prostitution, such as on Craig’s List under “erotic services,” you can see that the more restricted use is common.  Some ads say “no sex,” while it is clear that oral sex is on offer.  I’ll use the term “sex acts” with its old-fashioned meaning, however.

Second, paid sexual activity by actors and actresses involved in making pornographic videos seems to fall under the definition, but is usually not regarded as prostitution, as far as I know.  As far as I can tell making such movies and selling or renting them to adults is legal, and in fact a significant factor in the economy of a number of nations and states, including California.  Again, I’ll stick with the narrow definition, so that engaging in sex for pay, where the pay comes from the producer of a pornographic video rather than from the other sex partner or partners, doesn’t count as prostitution.  A philosopher will immediately ask, “what about the case where the producer of the video is also one of the actors?” but we’ll set that question aside, at least for the time being.

The paradigm act of prostitution is a female performing sexual intercourse with a male, not her husband, in exchange for money.  How, as is clear from Craig’s List, there are plenty of opportunities to purchase sex from males, too.

Philosophically, the main issue is presumably the rightness or wrongness of acts of prostitution and the distinct question of whether prostitution should be illegal in some or all of its forms.

On the former there seem to be four main positions, which of course overlap in various ways.

First, there is what I’ll call the moralist position.  Prostitution is immoral as a special case of the immorality of adultery.  This would be true even if the institution of prostitution, that is, the actual social, economic and marketing practices that surround the activity of prostitution, were not exploitative or in other ways damaging to prostitutes themselves.  The moralist tradition is often based on religious principles, like the Ten Commandments, one of which is not to commit adultery, but it need not be.

Second, at what we might call the other extreme, is what I’ll call the Consenting Adults position.  Sex acts for hire, between consenting adults, are perfectly moral in and of themselves, although of course it may be wrong to perform them in certain circumstances, say where one or both partners is breaking a promise to others, or in front of children, or traditionally, anywhere it might “scare the horses.” The exchange of money doesn’t change anything.

The third position I’ll call the Exploitative-Institution position agrees that there is nothing intrinsically wrong with sex acts between consenting adults.  However, the socio-economic practices that in fact, and as it seems inevitably, support the practice of prostitution ensure that it is almost invariably damaging to prostitutes, often economically, and also in terms of their self-esteem, opportunities, social position, health and myriad other ways.  To be involved in such an institution is wrong.  Our guest Debra Satz holds a subtle and well-argued version of this position.

The fourth position seems to me to be the one that underlies “COYOTE,” the San Francisco based prostitutes rights organization (See http://www.bayswan.org/COYOTE.html for links).  The acronym stands for “Cast off your old tired ethics”.  The fundamental idea is that “sex work,” including prostitution, stripping and other activities, needs to be de-stigmatized and de-criminalized, the role of “third-parties” --- i.e., pimps and other exploiters --- needs to be dealt with legally, and health and psychological services need to be made available. 

The difference between the third and fourth positions has to do with the extent to which prostitution is contingently degrading, exploitative, and in other ways damaging to prostitutes.  An adherent of the third position need not maintain that prostitution has these causes and effects as a matter of necessity, but may think that the social attitudes and institutions involved are so deeply enmeshed in American society and probably most others, that as a practical matter damage is inevitable and any participation in the institution is wrong.  An adherent of the fourth position may feel that prostitution, for some women, is at least potentially, and in some cases actually, a reasonable and attractive if not ideal occupation.

In The Second Sex Simone de Beauvoir provided a classic and influential discussion of prostitution, which is a good place to start reading, especially in chapter XIX, “Prostitutes and Hetairas.”  “Hetaira” is Greek for a high-class courtesan or concubine.  Hetairas might seem to provide the role-models for those who envisage non-exploitative prostitution, but de Beauvoir doesn’t see it that way.  Hetairas are...

...women who treat not only their bodies but their entire personalities as capital to be exploited... The hetaira does not reveal the world, she opens no avenues to human transcendence; on the contrary she tries to captivate the world for her own profit....she does not repudiate that passive femininity which dedicates her to man...

Well, we’ll understand these issues better tomorrow, after our discussion on “Philosophy Talk” with Debra Satz.

Comments (21)


Guest's picture

Guest

Sunday, May 15, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

This will be an interesting topic. A couple of co

This will be an interesting topic. A couple of comments:
I would be interested in hearing the guest defend what you have termed ?the Exploitative-Institution position? against a particular criticism that I believe would arise from the fourth position.
I am assuming that the guest believes, as described in the blog, that there is nothing intrinsically wrong with sex acts between consenting adults, even if those acts are perfomed in exchange for payment. To the extent then that the evils that an adherent of the Exploitative-Institution position believes surround prostitution are caused by social attitudes and institutions in American society, then is not the answer to work to change these attitudes and institutions rather than to condemn the institution itself?
For instance, to the extent that the speaker believes that the practice of prostitution is invariably damaging to the prostitute economically, because for example the pimp takes a large proportion of the prostitutes earnings, then let?s legalize prostitution, so that there is no need for protection by a pimp. Or, once legalized, we can regulate the amount that a pimp may charge for such protection, and give the prostitute an administrative avenue for redress if the pimp violates this regulation. If the act of prostitution is not in itself intrinsically wrong, then shouldn?t your speaker be helping to educate the public to this fact? Once prostitution is regarded by all as just another profession, then there will be no social stigma attached to it (or at least no more so than any other profession like, for instance, mine -- lawyer -- or yours (just kidding)).
Moreover, we appear to condemn only certain types of narrowly defined prostitution: the exchange of sex acts for money. As the old joke goes: What?s the difference between sex for love and sex for money? Sex for love is more expensive. The woman (or man) who has sex because someone pays him/her a couple of hundred dollars is a prostitute, but one who has sex because someone took him/her to drinks, dinner at an expensive restaurant, and then to a concert is not. The younger, attractive man or woman who consorts with the far older, unattractive, but wealthy person or the older men and women who ?prey? on other lonely, older, and wealthier retirees are all put in different categories than the prostitute, although the only difference would seem to be the directness and honesty of the transaction.
Any comments?

Guest's picture

Guest

Sunday, May 15, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

Women mainly want money from men! They are always

Women mainly want money from men! They are always on the prowl for a rich guy. When a woman looks at a man the first thing she is concerned with is how much money he has and how many things he can buy her: a house, a car, etc. When a young man looks at a woman he is mainly concerned with how she looks physically. Is not a woman a prostitute when she primarily cares about how much money a man has? Is not a man an idiot when he only cares about how the woman looks? No wonder there are so many divorces, and the divorce rate is so high. Financial problems do indeed cause many divorces because many relationships are based on money.
The birds and bees are hopefully taught to a son by his parents. I view strip clubs and prostitutes as a place where men are educated in the sad truth of how relationships really work: the man gets money (goes out and hunts and captures animal) and gives it to the woman (cavewoman) who uses it. There is no love in prostitution. Prostitution is sex. Sex is not love. Sex is physical, and love is mental.
Actors and actresses have sex on film for money. Is this not prostitution? What is the difference between sex on film and prostitution? Is not prostitution legal in some parts of the United States like Nevada? Is not modeling a form of prostitution, where women trade their beauty of youth for money. Models, actresses, and prostitutes all have to take care of their bodies and look beautiful.
Is it prostitution when women use their physical beauty to get men to fall in love with them, so that men will buy them objects such as jewelry, gifts, etc., in normal relationships making men go into debt? The majority of women use their physical beauty as a weapon, instead of their minds. Their minds are working on the belief that the only way they will get anything is through the exploitation of men, and that men are only good for one thing-money. Instead of going out and getting something themselves they use men to get it for them. That is why I consider most women money hungry.
Another example would be when a woman meets a dumb man, and her entire goal will be to get this man to impregnate her. Once she is pregnant she will have continuous access to his money, through child support payments, until the child is 18 years old. This is a common goal of many women who are used to living off of the welfare system. Is this not prostitution-creating a baby so that the woman can have access to a man?s money? Then there are women who look for very rich men, have sex with them and then claim the rich man raped them. Then the rich guy has to go to court and is found not guilty. Is this not prostitution, luring a rich man into sex just so that you can get his money? Then there are women who are looking for the rich guy who will take care of them for the rest of their lives, and everyone knows that if he had no money or an average income she would not be with him.
The main thing a man needs to do is get money, and never get a woman pregnant and never marry a woman. The money will attract women, and the prevention of pregnancy and marriage will keep women from getting your money. Sex is always for money, even when it is not blatantly apparent. There should be a scientific test between the relationships of money to sex, or how much money influences relationships. These tests should be similar to how being fat influences whether you get a job or fall in love.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, May 16, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

I find it interesting that it is generally recogni

I find it interesting that it is generally recognized that most prostitutes service men. Is this because the male sex drive is significantly different than that of women? Is prostitution governed by understandable economic theories of supply and demand, and unlikely to effected by legislation or moral pressure. What would happen if women no longer needed money due to advances in the social order, etc...?

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, May 16, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

this discussion, both radio and blog, was shocking

this discussion, both radio and blog, was shockingly devoid of even a remark upon the socio-political reality of poverty and its inordinate effects on the people we then find in the ranks of prostitution, not only women, but marginalized men and children, who are then further criminalized. failing to make linkages between the way society distributes wealth and power and the value and legal judgements doled out and to whom is so shortsighted as to be maddening. especially maddening become the comments about sexuality (or was it simply sex) being about one's specialness or self in such a way that it should not be shared with another, other than a particular one, or some such la-la. i happen to know folks whose sexuality is clearly of the "polyamorous" variety and they do not appear to be particularly dysfunctional or damaged or otherwise socially or soul-deformed. would either of you admit to having had only one lover ever in your life? why should a woman be constrained by a social more that criminalizes her for the same behaviour as others? sheesh, you guys. you can do a much better job than this. the quote of deBeauvoir won't wash. she never had to worry about whether she would pay her rent, get a meal or feed hungry kids. one has only to look at the disparities that persist in income, health and social status between the folks who currently are involved in prostitution to question the validity of a "moral" discussion of this sort.
bravo to mr. upjohn for his pithy comments.

Charlie's picture

Charlie

Monday, May 16, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

I would like to explore the view point that the se

I would like to explore the view point that the sex business (e.g.prostitution, lap dancing, Chippendale dancers, etc.), both male and female, is degrading not so much for the worker/provider, but to the client. Think about it, here's this poor schlub that, for whatever reason, wants his or her desire for sexual expression fulfilled but lacks the access to relationship(s)that will satisfy same. It seems to me that the workers are ultimately in control of the situation/transaction and that they recognize the simple supply-and-demand economics. What if there were zero inhibitions to any and all forms of sexual expression, i.e. the "free sex" communes of the Sixties? As the caller from Brazil commented, her country seemed to be more open and accepting in dealing with sexuality. I seem to recall primitive cultures whose attitudes toward adult? sexuality was very open.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, May 16, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

Listening to the end of the show, I thought a good

Listening to the end of the show, I thought a good way of thinking of prostitution, in comparison to selling a service like one's thoughts or goods like one's apples, is in regards to the honesty of the transaction. Part of what makes prostitution worse than a typical non-sexual transaction is the lie involved in the (presumed) representation of the prostitution's enjoyment, and whatever patter is needed to convince the client that there is pleasure.
If John or Ken were to misrepresent themselves in selling their thoughts/talk/writing, though we wouldn't literally call it prostitution, we'd still see it negatively, more negatively than if they provided services without pretense, for pay or not. This also captures the distinction with the proverbial high-class hooker/escort who chooses whether or not to sleep with a particular client: we believe the highly-paid escort only has sex if she really wants to.
This isn't an airtight argument against prostitution, but I think a good way of understanding (justifying?) why even some sex-positive people consider it problematic, and would do so even if it were legalized.
Of course, many people have jobs which involve pretense which is not obvious to the client (with an actor, the pretense is obvious; with a used car salesman or Fox news anchor, it sometimes is not). But those jobs are problematic, too.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, May 16, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

Although the reality of same-sex prostitution was

Although the reality of same-sex prostitution was acknowledged in the introduction, the radio discussion including listener comments focused on the heterosexual phenomenon where the moral issues involved -- if there are any -- may be more easily contaminated by the power issues inherent in heterosexuality. I wonder whether a clearer judgment of prostitution qua prostitution might be possible were only the same-sex phenomenon analysed.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, May 16, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

I think that the economic circumstances of those

I think that the economic circumstances of those who enter into prostitution are very important to our evaluation of the practice. I also agree that this could have been emphasized more in the discussion. At the very least, if someone morally objects to prostitution because they worry about the background circumstances of women who turn to the practice, they must take into account that closing off the practice may leave poor women in a worse situation than they would otherwise be. This is often the case when we regulate or close off a market. It is as true of markets in sex as of markets in body parts. But the fact that banning markets forecloses an option that may be best in bad circumstances isn't the end of the argument: in some cases despite something being the "best option" we may have reasons to foreclose it. But then we need to address to the underlying circumstances, which may now be worse.
As examples of "best options" which may be reasonable to ban: think of bans on mercenaries, bans on vote-selling, bans on organ sales, bans on child labor. Sometimes allowing a best option in bad circusmatnces precludes society achieving a better set of options: a society with child labor drives down the price of adult labor which makes it difficult for the poor in that society to avoid putting their children to work. Sometimes, bans are best for us all.
It also makes a difference if a ban on a market produces a black market which is worse for the parties of the exchange. If we care about poor women driven to prostitution than we should care about a black market which leaves them more vulnerable to violence, abuse and exploitation.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, May 23, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

I responded to some of these comments in "Sex, Pro

I responded to some of these comments in "Sex, Prostitution and Well-lived Lives." I think I didn't quite realize that there were 2 prostitution threads.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, June 20, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

I respect very much the Prostitutes in countries w

I respect very much the Prostitutes in countries where other honest work is impossible to find. Though Prostitution is dirty and dangerous, it does feed the family. I say legalize it, regulate it, and tax it.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, August 22, 2005 -- 5:00 PM

Has anybody read `She-Saviour`, by Mikhail Armalin

Has anybody read `She-Saviour`, by Mikhail Armalinsky?
He is a controversial Russian writer of erotic litrature.
This 44 page short essay about prostitute & prostitution is a brilliant & honest appraisal of the way society looks at prostitution & why! He finishs his essay with a lovely statement which I think is worth serious consideration:
`If prostitution is legalized as a necessary concession, as the lesser of two evils, it will remain a social problem. Prostitution will be, in that case, merely tolerated, which means that there will be moments when our leaders run out of patience & it will be once again criminalized. The legalization of prostitution `must` be based on the return of the divine, sacred character, so that prostitution will be considered the most honourable profession, the one closest to God, the holiest. In the distant future, people will realize, admit & openly cling to the miracle of orgasm & pleasure, embodied in the prostitute, & the essence of the world will change. The world will once again be pagan, but on a scientific-technical foundation that reachs for the stars.`
I know most of stopped the conversation re: prostitution, but I thought someone might be interested to view this subject from a males point of view,as well as a females, in a country where prostitution has stared to predominate, as with other east european countries, on the sex industry level.
Even though his work is `good-grief` level, I totally agree with the way he sees prostitutes & the way he sees `so-called-proper women.

Guest's picture

Guest

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 -- 5:00 PM

supoose you are ugly and out.You can then only dre

supoose you are ugly and out.You can then only dream of sex.Prostitution does offer a theoritical chance of gratifing your dream.

Guest's picture

Guest

Tuesday, May 9, 2006 -- 5:00 PM

THE JOHN'S TALE My typical weekend begins promp

THE JOHN'S TALE
My typical weekend begins promptly at 5pm on a Friday afternoon. Usually I and my mainly married colleagues will walk the couple of hundred yards to a bar near the train station which loosely describes itself as a ?British Pub?. This means the décor and furniture are in poor condition and the beer is warm. They used to have a Filipina working there who could actually speak English but she left.
Actually it?s not so bad and very convenient for a quick pint or two after work. As I drink I pull out my packet of continental menthol cigarettes and light up. I only smoke when I drink ? in fact I try and keep all my vices together in the hope that they will only count as one sin in total come the final reckoning. I am in many respects a bad man.
I spend an hour with my work mates becoming slowly more and more frustrated at the requirement for me to retain at least a modicum of respectability. Just before 6pm I run for the 6.01 train to the city centre and my transformation from almost respectable employee to whoremonger is nearly complete.
On the train I break out my hip flask and take quiet nips of vodka. I begin to relax after the exacting trials and tribulation of the so recently expired week of work. At the main train station it is a quick transfer to the bus and a 10 minute ride to the heart of the red-light zone.
My first stop is a Thai style bar and my usual hostess Nan brings me a glass of dry white Chardonnay as I light up another cigarette. ?Drink for me?? Nan asks and I nod almost imperceptibly.
Nan?s a cute looking girl and she doesn?t look her 30 years. She is slim and dresses in a revealing short skirt and skimpy top. She has a small son and no husband but I?ve never been able to tempt her to meet me outside the bar worse luck.
After two more drinks I tip Nan unnecessarily and walk to the main drag of the strip. I have a drink in a few more bars and chat to some girls I know. Almost everyone knows me around here. At work a woman once mentioned that she?d read in the paper that there were 2000 prostitutes in this city. ?2000?? I said. ?I must know all of them...?. Even she thought that was funny.
Most of the freelancers working the bars are African, Brazilian or Cuban with a sprinkling of Russians and other east Europeans. The Thais are mainly in the erotic clubs and massage parlours which I rarely visit as it is too controlled (and expensive) for my taste.
In one of the bars suddenly Claudia wanders in and immediately makes a bee-line for me. ?Hey Paul do you wanna buy me a drink?? she coos. ?OK,? I reply and she slides in next to me at the bar and begins stroking my thigh.
Claudia is 28, good-looking, African, English speaking, no kids. She has a number of piercings and I?ve been with her several times before. ?Do you wanna come with me short time or I?ll stay with you tonight if you like??. She flutters her eyelids mockingly. ?OK, short time,? I say.
We walk to her small one-room apartment and do the business. It costs me around £100 for an hour. (This is an expensive city.) I emerge from the apartment block into the rain and make my way to my favourite bar. This bar has a band every night and a quiet Thai restaurant/bar attached which is good for chatting once you have selected your potential mate for the night.
I wander through the bar and say hello to several girls and a few other whoremongers I recognise. I am looking for Nina but in the end it is Nina who finds me. In French she exclaims ?Paul, where have you been? I?ve been looking everywhere for you.? I smile, escort her to the small, quiet bar and buy a bottle of dry white wine for the two of us.
My O-level French is not very good but it is good enough for our purposes. ?Paul, I want to stay with you tonight. Tomorrow I have to go back to Paris. OK?? I nod. I like Nina. She?s also 28, African, French speaking, big smile and warm personality. She has one kid in Africa and a caesarean.
She?s not the cutest girl on the game here but she?s has got a nice ass. She is also very friendly, good fun and I trust her enough to have her in my home. I trust Claudia too as it happens but as it turns out tonight is Nina?s night. We have something to eat and then get a taxi back to my apartment.
In the morning I drink a bottle of white wine while Nina does a pretty good job of cleaning my apartment. After lunch we retire to the bedroom for an hour. Later we shower together, dry ourselves and get dressed. I give her £400 and then walk her to the train station to buy her a train ticket back to the city.
?A la prochaine fois!? she says as she kisses me. ?Yes see you next time, honey,? I reply. She gets aboard the train and waves at me until she?s out of sight. I like Nina, she?s sweet. They are all sweet ? well nearly all.
I spend the rest of Saturday afternoon drinking wine and doing chores until I fall asleep sozzled and content. I have bust my weekend budget of £500 so next weekend I?ll have to cut back a bit. Yeah next weekend??.
Sunday is my day of rest. No women, no fags and no booze. Just a very bad hangover, plenty of bottled water and plenty of sleep. With luck I?ll just about be fit for work tomorrow morning.
You might think that this lifestyle is a bit risky. I would say that my lifestyle and that of the girls around me is riskier than most but nowhere near as risky as most people would probably imagine.
You might also think that it is impossible to love a prostitute but that?s not true either. I love (in my own way) all the women I associate with. They are different, daring, unusual, sexy and alluring. They are in addition a surprisingly kind bunch of people.
Prostitution isn?t well understood (or well regarded) in the UK. It?s generally thought of as a seedy, dirty world populated by drug addicts, pimps, pushers, traffickers, criminals and sad people (like me).
Now, no doubt all of these types of individuals exist in the sex industry here (& elsewhere) but this is largely due to the illegal nature of the trade and the lack, therefore, of any regulation except the prosecution of all and sundry (weather permitting).
I have a great deal of experience of prostitutes. I am 47 and over the last 15 years I have paid for sex with women in the UK, USA, Holland, Switzerland, the Philippines and Thailand.
I have had good (mostly) and bad experiences. I regard myself as a professional John. Being a professional John, however, doesn?t pay well. Sebastian Horsley says in his article ?The Brothel Creeper? (Why I?ve slept with 1000 women) that it cost him £100,000. I?ve spent a similar amount on only 500 women so he must either be cheap or a better negotiator.
Why do I go to prostitutes? Well, I don?t want a traditional girlfriend and I don?t want to do one night stands. Plus if I pay I get who I want (within reason) no strings attached.
Prostitution is not all sleaze, pimps and drugs. It is women?s business and it can be classy and expensive. The double-standard employed by government whereby it appears sex can be packaged and used to sell almost anything for a profit by anyone except women themselves for their own well-being.
Society at large should stop victimising whores (and Johns) who are engaging in natural human activity and press for the decriminalisation of prostitution.
-Paul Pisces (Author of "Desperately Seeking Sex & Sobriety")

Laura's picture

Laura

Sunday, February 25, 2007 -- 4:00 PM

I back up what Paul says.

I back up what Paul says.

Guest's picture

Guest

Friday, April 13, 2007 -- 5:00 PM

Feminists all have the idea that prostitution is w

Feminists all have the idea that prostitution is wrong and bad. They see this because of the way society has made them believe that certain things are right and others are wrong. This is how they evaluate prostitution; by looking at its rightness and wrongness. Prostitution, however, is one of those things that is seen bad not only by the radical feminists. Conventional morality tells everyone it is wrong and prostitution is forseen as inappropriate behavior. The reason as to why prostitution is wrong has nothing to do with the fact that it degrades other women, and this is what feminists incline towards.
The true reason to why prostitution is wrong is because it leads to a degenerate behavior, and so, it should be illegal. There are two types of behaviors, generative and degenerative and the government should enforce the prohibition of the latter.
Prostitution has been something that has been prohibited in our society always and it shouldn?t be up to the new morality or new ethical theory to change all of this. Classical ethical theory tells us it is wrong and it would not logically hold to change this view today.
If society was to change the norms as they would please, then all systems of moral theory would be inconsistent and there would be chaos. The fact that society is what determines morality would be even more apparent and people would lose respect for any moral laws.
The fact that prostitution is morally wrong derives from moral sentiments that view certain behaviors as degenerative and others as generative. The parties involved in prostitution must consider what they are doing in terms of generative or degenerative behavior. If prostitution is causing a degeneration of values and attitudes, moral concern must be taken into consideration.
On one hand, if prostitution was a positive circumstance that leads to personal growth, other people ought to focus their attentions on other aspects of potentially degenerative behavior in society. For example, the consumption of alcoholic drinks at social gatherings seems fairly generative up to a certain point. However, if consumption becomes frequent and obsessive it then becomes alcoholism, which is a degenerative behavior that can totally change the person. Alcohol addiction changes a person?s behavior radically. That is why for some people the consumption of alcohol is a degenerative activity.
If prostitution is not regulated, degenerative behaviors can evolve. Prostitutes want rights and the freedom to practice their trade. But problems can arise from this. Making prostitution a professional and legal occupation will help keep prostitutes on a generative course of personal evolution. To the extent that prostitutes are willing to regulate themselves, as other professionals do, society might be inclined to a greater acceptance of sex workers. This potential relationship is later explored in a theory of social assimilation.

Guest's picture

Guest

Wednesday, September 26, 2007 -- 5:00 PM

Personal experience with someone I know patroning

Personal experience with someone I know patroning a prostitute caused me to look up blog comments on the issue. It seems many women and men have a casual idea about the use thereof. And though I agree with you on some of your transaction points, the moral dilemma for me is it is taking advantage of someone, who whether they understand this or not, is not healthy. I know the liberal advance for women on many respects is "its my body" But we are not talking about just a body, we are talking about a human, heart, mind and emotions. The funny thing is that society is always telling women that their emotions are counterproductive to their success. Strength is in stoicism, and I think that is a canker sore waiting. I think the design of women's sensibilities, nurturing and closeness to heart matters is a very important fiber to a society. Destroying that is a catastrophic blow to the foundation of a "good" society. By good society I mean that it is one to model, one that gives its citizens the freedom to become the free-est beings. Too often freedom is defined in self destructive terms, and the line especially for women has become too blurred. No matter how empowered a women feels by sexually exploiting herself, it still in the end is exploitation. But we have taken the things that take strength, commitment, determination and self will and made them weak, giving power to shallow instant pursuits that destroy the spirit of man and women alike. A man, no matter the reason, that patrons a prostitute is going to satisfy his self. Whether it is the itch, or basic loneliness there is no noble cause to why this transaction occurs. It happens in relationships as well, we look to our partner to satisfy our emptiness-es our with-outs, and that is not all bad, but it is when it is how we value them. How important they are is defined by how well they meet our needs.
So the issue for me is human to human, somebody who sells "their body" is usually operating from a depraved or mistaken place. Some where that tells them being accepted sexually by men is a powerful place, somewhere that tells them that sex can be deployed separate from their heart mind and self value. Sometimes it is just out of desperation and all in all someone who takes advantage of or patrons that could never pay for the actual cost of what they are taking from that person.

Guest's picture

Guest

Wednesday, April 2, 2008 -- 5:00 PM

Hi there, We have a show up today on MobLogic t

Hi there,
We have a show up today on MobLogic that focuses on this issue.
In the show, our host, Lindsay Campbell, l goes out onto the streets of LA to ask people why porn is legal but prostitution is not.
http://www.moblogic.tv/video/2008/04/03/why-is-porn-legal/
On the blog, we look at the politics of these two industries, and how that factors in to the legality of each.
http://www.moblogic.tv/blog/2008/04/03/look-dont-touch/
Stop by, check it out if you have the time. We'd love to hear your opinion.
Thanks for your time,

Guest's picture

Guest

Saturday, April 5, 2008 -- 5:00 PM

This issue needs a lot more discussion, so thanks

This issue needs a lot more discussion, so thanks for starting the conversation so well. I write casual thoughts at my blog http://www.cuntlet.com and I for years tried to stay in touch with the real world via eroticmassage.blogs.com, where john's and working ladies sent me stories of their lives. I would love to participate in a value-based discussion about this. While other girls fill their in-between-customer time doing their nails, I think. Missy

Guest's picture

Guest

Tuesday, September 16, 2008 -- 5:00 PM

A lot of the johns are alcohol or drug addicts. S

A lot of the johns are alcohol or drug addicts. So are the "sex workers". This is the part that is getting overlooked.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, May 18, 2009 -- 5:00 PM

When a endangered species (that'd be me - American

When a endangered species (that'd be me - American born, foreign raised, NEVER into smoking , drinking , or any illicit activities)..remained VIRGIN TILL MARRIAGE at late age, to settle down..RIGHT THEN his low-life wife of 5 years finds a greener grass TAKING OFF with the only child(and his only close relation, in his birth land U.S.A.). NOW this low wage earning ex-husband(and ex- dad..cause he is now called by name), a fter paying 20% in Child Support + 10% in Individual Health Insurance (not to mention driving 400miles(thru low-speed-limit small towns) to "visit" child (this gas money could have been saved for child's education), more restriction in getting jobs and/or apartment leased(for being a single man now)..I'm left with $800/month (after paying that 30% for "kid"nappers PLUS paying my own income tax)to pay rent,food,and other essential bills. NOTICE HERE => For the "low-life" ..she just had to spread her legs to get all the benefits..and I can't even afford a whore,much less a wife (who would, one day just might spread her wings (read legs)in the same evil way. So all the morons out there(who are against prostitution)...what would be a "fair" and "equal" alternative, than legalizing prostitution (If you ask me..I'd suggest whip-lashing the cheaters, in public....IT'LL WORK & DETERS MANY POTENTIAL CHEATERS..and you still don't have to join the TALIBANS). I shouldn't have been thinking about prostitution, while being a father. WHAT FATHER ??? Divorce Court made me a "VISITOR" for 9 hours every 14 days (with NO OVERNIGHT STAY). And with "CHILD ALIENATION" by her leg spreading mother..to call me by my name(instead of usual "DAD")..she would always consider me a "MONEY BANK"..not caring me as a father. And when the day would come for her to be free from her mother's custody...she would be taking off to distant college, and be off with her personal life. And HERE, "I" as an old "UNCARED & UNLOVED" father , still be praying God almighty to lift me up...since "SUICIDE" is another means not LEGALIZED by inhumane government. Government just want to torment NON- CUSTODIAL PARENTS (mostly fathers), by squeezing every penny out to give it to the DIVORCE FRIENDLY CHEATERS ..and to create a load of Judicial employments...ALL AT THE COST (& LIFE)OF "CURRENT" & "POTENTIAL" NON-CUSTODIAL PARENTS. For REAL (and TRUE) BEST INTERESTS OF THESE "BRAINWASHED" INNOCENT CHILD(REN), PLEASE SUPPORT & JOIN "FATHERS' RIGHTS ORGANIZATIONS", nearby. GOD BLESS YOU ALL (except SINNERS and CHEATERS alike).AMEN.

 

Listen:

 
 

Blog Archive

2018

September

August

July

June

May

April

March

February

January

2017

December

November

October

September

August

July

June

May

April

March

February

January

2016

December

October

September

August

July

June

May

April

March

February

January

2015

December

November

October

September

August

July

June

May

April

March

February

January

2005

December

November

October

September

August

July

June

May

April

March